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Dry Needling for Pain Relief | What You Need To Know
Pam Digiovanna discusses the technique of dry needling for pain relief.
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Pam Digiovanna
Dr. Pam Digiovanna has 12 years of experience as a doctor of physical therapy. She is a certified kinesiotape practitioner, an orthopedic board-certified specialist and a Certified Workman's Compensation Healthcare Professional. She also is certified in dry needling and in mechanical diagnosis and therapy (McKenzie method). Transcription:
Bill Klaproth: (Host) Anyone living with chronic pain or suffering from conditions such as arthritis, sciatica, or headaches, please listen up. We have a podcast for you. Cause our topic today might just offer a solution. It's called dry needling and it's a treatment for all those conditions and more. So here to fill us in on this type of treatment is Pam Digiovanna, a physical therapist with Tidelands Health. Pam so great to talk with you. Thank you for your time. So first off, can you explain to us what is dry needling?
Pam Digiovanna: (Guest) Dry needling is just the use of very fine small needles that are inserted in the skin. The reason they call it dry versus wet, wet needling is when you get an injection and sort of liquid in there, your cortisones, your lidocaine's. These have no injectate, they call it, or no medication. So, it's just the needle. They call it dry needling.
Host: So then what type of conditions can dry needling be used to treat?
Pam: Short answer is anything. Anything that you would come and see a physical therapist for we can use dry needling for. For example, we can treat arthritis. We can treat sciatica, headaches, pretty much anything you would come to a physical therapist for, dry needling can be used for that condition.
Host: And then generally, how many treatment sessions does it usually take for a patient to see improvement?
Pam: What I tell people is I found is that you do one session, dry needling, and the person will either have no change at all or you're going to be like 80% better. And so that person that's 80% better takes up to three sessions to be, 100% or get as much as you're going to get out of needling. And then, unfortunately, the person that it really didn't do anything for might not have a benefit with dry needling.
Host: So, Pam, I'm just curious. What's the difference between dry needling and acupuncture?
Pam: Easy answer is it's the philosophy behind it. So, the dry needling that I do is different than what most physical therapists will do. Most physical therapists will do a dry needling that is just putting the needle into a tight band of muscle and trying to relax that. So once that procedure in the tight band of muscle is done at the last few seconds and the muscle will be released. The dry needling that I do and a few other physical therapists at Tidelands do is a hybrid between acupuncture and that trigger point needling or muscle needling. And it actually uses acupuncture points as well as putting the needle into a tight muscle. So, this type of dry needling we're it encompasses the acupuncture points as well as muscle points, is not different than acupuncture, except for the philosophy. We don't think that we're changing meridians or changing your chi. We look at it as a Western medicine type of philosophy.
Host: So, it sounds like the physiology behind this is the needle loosens that tight muscle and it's the tight muscle that is really causing the problem, is that correct?
Pam: That would be for if we're treating a muscle only. And then if we're doing the other types of needling for say, Arthritis or for sciatica, we'd be putting the needle along the joint or along the nerve to try to influence and circulation mostly at those areas.
Host: So, you're helping the body to heal itself. Wow, really interesting. So then for someone listening, who is saying to themselves, I want this, how do I get this? Who is an ideal candidate for dry needling?
Pam: Anybody really, there's definitely red flags. Meaning if you've had surgery in the last 12 weeks, we don't want to do dry needling in that area. If you are on blood thinners or have a bleeding disorder, that would be a negative. And one other major one would be if you're immune-compromised Where you have, immune system issue, something like that. Otherwise, almost anybody can benefit if they are willing.
Host: It seems like a good option for somebody who may have tried medication or traditional physical therapy. It seems like a great option to try, is that a good way to think about it?
Pam: Yes, and in a different way, this is a fairly new intervention within physical therapy in the last five years. So, it's something brand new that we can try, and it can be really successful.
Host: And then Pam, last question. I'm sure you get this all the time, is it painful?
Pam: Yes and no. Certain points you might not feel at all, and then some points, you might feel like a little prick of a needle, but they're very, very stingy. So, it'd be, it's a very minor Prick. and we do manipulate the needle. We do rotate it around. So, we look for, kind of like a deep burn is what we say. And it lasts about two or three seconds and it goes away and then you don't feel anything the rest of the time.
Host: Well, that sounds like a worthwhile trade-off to potentially heal what you're suffering from. Well, this has really been interesting. Thank you so much for talking to us about dry needling, Pam, we appreciate it. Thank you for your time.
Pam: Yeah, no problem. Thank you.
Host: That's Pam Digiovanna. and to learn more, please visit TidelandsHealth.org or call 1-866-Tidelands to make an appointment. And if you found this podcast helpful, please share it on your social channels and check out the full podcast library for topics of interest to you. This is Better Health Radio, I'm Bill Klaproth. Thanks for listening.
Bill Klaproth: (Host) Anyone living with chronic pain or suffering from conditions such as arthritis, sciatica, or headaches, please listen up. We have a podcast for you. Cause our topic today might just offer a solution. It's called dry needling and it's a treatment for all those conditions and more. So here to fill us in on this type of treatment is Pam Digiovanna, a physical therapist with Tidelands Health. Pam so great to talk with you. Thank you for your time. So first off, can you explain to us what is dry needling?
Pam Digiovanna: (Guest) Dry needling is just the use of very fine small needles that are inserted in the skin. The reason they call it dry versus wet, wet needling is when you get an injection and sort of liquid in there, your cortisones, your lidocaine's. These have no injectate, they call it, or no medication. So, it's just the needle. They call it dry needling.
Host: So then what type of conditions can dry needling be used to treat?
Pam: Short answer is anything. Anything that you would come and see a physical therapist for we can use dry needling for. For example, we can treat arthritis. We can treat sciatica, headaches, pretty much anything you would come to a physical therapist for, dry needling can be used for that condition.
Host: And then generally, how many treatment sessions does it usually take for a patient to see improvement?
Pam: What I tell people is I found is that you do one session, dry needling, and the person will either have no change at all or you're going to be like 80% better. And so that person that's 80% better takes up to three sessions to be, 100% or get as much as you're going to get out of needling. And then, unfortunately, the person that it really didn't do anything for might not have a benefit with dry needling.
Host: So, Pam, I'm just curious. What's the difference between dry needling and acupuncture?
Pam: Easy answer is it's the philosophy behind it. So, the dry needling that I do is different than what most physical therapists will do. Most physical therapists will do a dry needling that is just putting the needle into a tight band of muscle and trying to relax that. So once that procedure in the tight band of muscle is done at the last few seconds and the muscle will be released. The dry needling that I do and a few other physical therapists at Tidelands do is a hybrid between acupuncture and that trigger point needling or muscle needling. And it actually uses acupuncture points as well as putting the needle into a tight muscle. So, this type of dry needling we're it encompasses the acupuncture points as well as muscle points, is not different than acupuncture, except for the philosophy. We don't think that we're changing meridians or changing your chi. We look at it as a Western medicine type of philosophy.
Host: So, it sounds like the physiology behind this is the needle loosens that tight muscle and it's the tight muscle that is really causing the problem, is that correct?
Pam: That would be for if we're treating a muscle only. And then if we're doing the other types of needling for say, Arthritis or for sciatica, we'd be putting the needle along the joint or along the nerve to try to influence and circulation mostly at those areas.
Host: So, you're helping the body to heal itself. Wow, really interesting. So then for someone listening, who is saying to themselves, I want this, how do I get this? Who is an ideal candidate for dry needling?
Pam: Anybody really, there's definitely red flags. Meaning if you've had surgery in the last 12 weeks, we don't want to do dry needling in that area. If you are on blood thinners or have a bleeding disorder, that would be a negative. And one other major one would be if you're immune-compromised Where you have, immune system issue, something like that. Otherwise, almost anybody can benefit if they are willing.
Host: It seems like a good option for somebody who may have tried medication or traditional physical therapy. It seems like a great option to try, is that a good way to think about it?
Pam: Yes, and in a different way, this is a fairly new intervention within physical therapy in the last five years. So, it's something brand new that we can try, and it can be really successful.
Host: And then Pam, last question. I'm sure you get this all the time, is it painful?
Pam: Yes and no. Certain points you might not feel at all, and then some points, you might feel like a little prick of a needle, but they're very, very stingy. So, it'd be, it's a very minor Prick. and we do manipulate the needle. We do rotate it around. So, we look for, kind of like a deep burn is what we say. And it lasts about two or three seconds and it goes away and then you don't feel anything the rest of the time.
Host: Well, that sounds like a worthwhile trade-off to potentially heal what you're suffering from. Well, this has really been interesting. Thank you so much for talking to us about dry needling, Pam, we appreciate it. Thank you for your time.
Pam: Yeah, no problem. Thank you.
Host: That's Pam Digiovanna. and to learn more, please visit TidelandsHealth.org or call 1-866-Tidelands to make an appointment. And if you found this podcast helpful, please share it on your social channels and check out the full podcast library for topics of interest to you. This is Better Health Radio, I'm Bill Klaproth. Thanks for listening.